Two weeks ago we began a series on the planetary archetypes in astrology. Each of these planets have a different role to play, both positive and negative, and can have various influences on your life.
When you learn the role of these planetary energies, you can learn to balance them with one another, increasing some here and decreasing some there, so as to live the purposeful, deliberate path of a creator.
Today we discuss the collective planets: Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. These planets define generations, instead of just individuals, thus why they are called “collective”. An But they hold invaluable insight into the way you lead your life and approach your goals.
Music composed by Collective Intelligence Music
Discussed in today’s podcast (click the link to jump to that section of the transcript):
- Categorization in astrology
- Jupiter’s attributions
- Jupiter energy
- Are we in the Age of Aquarius?
- Balancing Jupiter and Saturn
- All of the planets play a role
Brandon: Welcome to The Unseen World. This is episode 4, “The Planetary Archetypes and Their Role in the Creation Process: Part II: The Collective Planets.” I am Brandon Olivares.
Christine: And I’m Christine Olivares.
Justin: I’m Justin Williams.
Brandon: You sound unsure today. Last week you were excited. Today you sound unsure. [laughs]
Justin: I’m a little unsure.
Brandon: A little unsure. [laughs]
Justin: Last week I’m like, “We have a guest! This is going to be awesome,” and it was.
Brandon: You were psyched last week.
Justin: I was psyched.
Christine: We should get more guests.
Brandon: I know, right?
Today we are talking about Part II, as I said in the title, obviously, of the podcast we did two weeks ago in The Unseen World, where we talked about the first five planets of astrology. This oddly included the Sun and the Moon, which really aren’t planets, but we say they are. We started that off with how they influence your life and how they play a role in your everyday life whether you know it or not and how you can use that to balance things and to really help with the creation process and creating what you want in life.
Today, we’re discussing the other five planets: Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, Pluto. Yes, Pluto is still a planet in astrology. We’re not going with the flow of people who say Pluto is not a planet. We’re stubborn.
That’s what we’re discussing today. These planets are a totally different type of energy than what we call the personal planets. You’ll see that in this podcast.
First of all, before any of that, let me make some announcements. If you would like to see today’s show notes and read the transcript or leave a comment on the podcast, you can go to darkascent.org/unseen004.
I’m always psyched about this topic because it’s always extremely interesting. I love astrology, and hopefully that shows.
Christine: He’s darn good at it.
Justin: I’ve always wanted to learn more about astrology. I’ve read books on it, but I think I’m going to really get back into it pretty soon. I enjoy it.
Brandon: You should. It’s really interesting.
Categorization in Astrology
Brandon: I want to point out for simplification I divided the planets into two categories: the personal and the collective. That’s true, but in reality, you can divide them into four categories. I’ll discuss that now. The first category is the luminaries. That is the Sun and the Moon.
Christine: Makes sense.
Brandon: Those are our major and minor luminaries. Then the personal planets are technically Mercury, Venus, and Mars. I mention this for a reason I’ll say in a second. Then you have the social planets, which are Jupiter and Saturn. I’ve put them into the category of “collective” here, but their subcategory is the social planets.
The transpersonal planets are Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. They are transpersonal because they define generations: Uranus being 7 years in a sign, Neptune being 14 or so years, Pluto being 13-32 years. They define generations. That is a whole different area than just the personal planets or even the social planets, which might spend a year or two in a sign. It’s just totally on another level entirely. Those are really the four categories of planets.
The reason I mention that is the transpersonal planets are what are called “higher octaves” of the personal planets. Did you ever hear of that, Justin or Christine?
Justin: No, I haven’t, actually.
Christine: No. Is it kind of like what you teach about—I don’t mean to bring another subject in—the chakras, when one reflects the other?
Brandon: Yes, really close, very close. It’s basically that it takes the energy of the equivalent personal planet and takes it up a notch. Uranus is the higher octave of Mercury. We’ll talk about why later. Neptune is the higher octave of Venus. Pluto is the higher octave of Mars. It’s similar energy, but it takes it up an octave. It’s not exactly the same meaning, but it’s similar. It’s broader and more collective, obviously. It’s more intense, usually.
These are very intense planets. All of the transpersonal planets (all three of them) were only discovered only within the last 200 years or so. They are more recent, so their meaning has evolved. It’s more evident, also, what their influence on the world has been because of that, which I’ll get into later. I just wanted to make that note before we get into any of that kind of discussion.
Brandon: First of all, we’re going to be getting into the social planets, like I said, Jupiter and Saturn. Jupiter and Saturn—that connection is actually the whole reason I wanted to do this series. The relationship between Jupiter and Saturn is so interesting and so useful for our everyday lives. That really deserves covering, and we’ll cover this quite a bit today, I think. It’s hard to separate them, so I’m not going to try to separate them too much. In fact, when I was reading up on the planets, I was reading some articles earlier. The astrologer who had written these articles actually merged Jupiter and Saturn into one article because they are so interrelated. You really can’t separate them too much. They are two sides of the same coin, but they are like night and day. First of all, Justin, do you know much about Jupiter itself?
Justin: You mean as the planet?
Brandon: Yes. Well, as the astrology.
Justin: It’s about abundance, money. Its correspondences are oranges, apples, the abundance like fruit. Fluorite is one of the stones that goes with Jupiter. Some of the bluish stones go with Jupiter, like sapphire and some of the blue crystals, topaz.
Brandon: Abundance is one of the things it’s often associated with. That is true.
Justin: Its day is Thursday.
Brandon: Its day is yes, Thursday. That is true. It does have to do with abundance, in a way, but that’s not really its major attribution. Actually, the planet of Jupiter has everything to do with expansion.
Justin: Expansion. There you go. That’s the other word I was…
Brandon: In Indian astrology or Vedic astrology, Jupiter is called the guru. It’s the spiritual teacher. It’s very, very, very advantageous. It has a lot of positive attributions to it, which is really good. It is luck. It’s expansion. It’s freedom, all that kind of thing. Unexpected luck. I guess all luck is unexpected. If it’s abundance, it’s unexpected abundance. It’s not something you work hard for. That’s more Saturn, which we’ll talk about. Saturn can lead to abundance, too, but Saturn is more “you work your way up the corporate ladder and you get there.”
Justin: You grind it out.
Brandon: Jupiter is more the overnight success. “Oh, wow, all these things lined up.” That’s the kind of thing we’re all looking for with the law of attraction, isn’t it? We’re looking for that big success. We’re looking for that instant breakthrough or lottery win that will bring us to the success we’re looking for.
I think a lot of what I’ve talked about is sort of going against that. I say, “Actually, you sort of need to—yes, that can happen.” I’m reading a book about a lottery winner who won several times using the law of attraction. He’s explaining how he did it.
But in general, it takes a more progressive path to get there. You want more of the Saturn energy mixed in. That’s what I’ll talk about. Jupiter is all about expansion. It definitely is, and freedom.
Jupiter in Greek mythology is Zeus. Jupiter is (in Greek mythology) the supreme god. You would think the Sun would be Apollo, or whatever, but it’s actually Zeus. Jupiter is the biggest of all the planets. It’s very similar to the Sun in that way. But it’s more in a spiritual, higher way. It’s not a higher octave of the Sun, but it’s similar in that way. That’s what Jupiter is all about.
I know a lot of people are really drawn to Jupiter because of that, like I said, because they want that instant success. They want that breakthrough. People are always psyched when Jupiter comes through their second house. The second house is finances.
Justin: Oh, yeah.
Brandon: People are psyched when it comes through their second house. Usually it doesn’t have the intended effect, because it’s not so clear-cut. It’s not so clear-cut as people think.
Justin: My Jupiter’s in Leo, but I don’t know what house it’s in.
Brandon: Your Jupiter is in your 8th house, which is probably why you’re interested in occult matters. The 8th house is very occult.
Christine: Do you want to check mine?
Justin: One of the things you ought to do is focus on the house if you want abundance. Focus on the part of your chart that Jupiter is in and see if you can find abundance in that house.
Brandon: Exactly. Right. That’s something you would be able to look at. If you want to look at abundance, you want to look at what planet is in your second house, the ruler of your second house and where that is. It’s very complex.
Christine’s Jupiter is actually the same as mine as far as house placement. Hers is in the ninth house, in Cancer. Mine is in the ninth house in Gemini.
Justin: Yeah. That’s interesting.
Brandon: For me, it’s always been that Jupiter has a lot of similarities to Sagittarius. Sagittarius is the philosopher. The ninth house is the philosopher, too. It’s very well-placed in the ninth house. This is very, very spiritual and religious sort of thinking. That’s how mine is in Gemini, which is communication and writing. No wonder I like to write about spirituality.
Christine: What about me?
Brandon: Cancer is really more of a healing thing, honestly.
Christine: Oh, really?
Brandon: Sure. Sure. Yes, that’s Jupiter. It’s all about luck and freedom and success and expansion. It’s a lot of fun, but we can get carried away with that really fun, awesome Jupiter energy. We can get carried away. What happens with people with a lot of Jupiter is that (and this has been my problem in the past; I’ve mostly curbed this tendency) to start a lot of projects you have such inspiration for, and then they fizzle out. Have you ever had that happen?
Christine: Yes, a little bit.
Brandon: I have all the time.
Justin: I’m usually pretty good at not having—especially now, but that’s happened before.
Brandon: You have this project you really want to do. You start it, and you’re really inspired. Then it just sort of fizzles out. With Jupiter, it’s very fast-acting. You want to get it right away and that’s it. But projects, a lot of times, require a lot more long-lasting energy, so (we’ll talk about Saturn in a minute) you need the more long-lasting Saturn discipline order working through it all kind of thing. It’s two sides of the same coin. That’s the error that a lot of people fall into when they have a lot of Jupiter energy. Especially (like I said) if Jupiter is in the second house or transiting the second house, it’s like “Yay! I’m going to have a lot of money!” but not so much. You might have a windfall or something, but if your vibration is not aligned with that, it’s not always going to last a long time.
Christine: Mine must have been there recently.
Brandon: There was a story. I was reading this article. It was several months ago, I think. Someone told a story of a wife whose husband had Jupiter in the second house. She’s like, “He doesn’t work, so I don’t get how Jupiter is in the second house.” Well, his wife totally supports him. Before he was married, his parents totally supported him. He hasn’t had to work a day in his life. He gets everything he wants pretty much, but it’s given to him directly.
Justin: His wife didn’t understand that? The reason why is his Jupiter is in the second house and it works.
Brandon: [laughs] Exactly.
Christine: I’m not supporting you. Go get a job.
Brandon: That’s the kind of thing. It just sort of comes to you. You don’t necessarily have to do the work—not that that’s always a good thing. That’s the kind of thing that was going on. I don’t remember where her Jupiter was, but it was somewhere else. She was the one doing all the work. That can definitely happen.
Saturn is the one that says, “I need to get a good job. I need to get a good career and get down into the world and play my role in it” and that kind of stuff. A lot of spirituality, I find, if you’ve noticed, (and I’ve done this, absolutely—I’ll talk about Uranus in a little while, which is pretty similar to Jupiter in this way that I’m about to say) we don’t like authority. A lot of us eclectic spiritual types don’t like authority very much. We don’t like structure very much. We don’t like Saturn, but Saturn plays an essential role in all that. I’ll explain why in a minute. We want to go after this Jupiter energy. We want to have this expansion. We talk about the New Age of Aquarius and freedom and whatever, but we don’t want to put in the work. That’s sort of what happens with Jupiter.
Are We in the Age of Aquarius?
Christine: Are we in Aquarius yet, the Age of Aquarius, or no?
Brandon: Depends on who you ask. I don’t think so, not if you look at…
Justin: I thought we were in the Age of Aquarius.
Brandon: Not if you look at…
Justin: Everything I’ve seen is the Aquarian Age, but that doesn’t mean it’s right. That just means that’s what I’ve seen.
Brandon: I don’t think that we’re in Aquarius quite yet, because if you look at the procession of the equinoxes (I could not remember that term to save my life), we’re still in 5° Pisces. We’re seeing the beginnings of Aquarius, but it’s not for another 100 years or so. The procession of the equinoxes is basically how over time, the point of the vernal equinox where we’re at what we would imagine as 0° Aries is pointing progressively backwards through Pisces, not at Aries. The signs are associated with the constellations.
Brandon: When astrology was first formed, the signs and the constellations were equal. Aries was the Aries constellation. Taurus was the Taurus constellation, etc. As time went on, we kept March 21 as the vernal equinox and the beginning of Aries. That’s just how it is, but if you look at the constellations that match up, we’re going backwards through them so that we’re actually almost to Aquarius at this point. The Age of Aquarius is when the vernal equinox would be in Aquarius, not in Aries or Pisces. So right now we’re in the Age of Pisces. Each one lasts about 2500 years. It depends on the calculations you use. Technically, we’re still in the Age of Pisces, and we’re getting there. You’re starting to see the beginnings of it. You’ve been seeing the beginnings of it for about 100 years now, but we’re not technically there yet.
Christine: So that song about the Age of Aquarius is a little early.
Brandon: Yes, a little bit. People jump the gun. They wanted to think that 2012 began the Age of Aquarius or whatever. There are lots of things, but it’s not quite yet, probably not until 2150 or so. That’s when we enter the Age of Aquarius technically.
We like to go after Jupiter. We like to go after Jupiter and all the expansion that that entails and not having structure and that kind of stuff. That’s sort of our thing. I get that. But Saturn, which is the other side of that coin, is a necessary part of that, albeit one that we don’t like very much.
Christine: It’s kind of like a strict father or something.
Brandon: Yes. It’s sort of like a pendulum. We were in very strict religious—if you want to think of Saturn, think of the Church.
Justin: I like Saturn.
Christine: Of course you do. I’m joking.
Brandon: Think of the Church. Think of tradition. Think of what’s expected of us. For a lot of us, we’ve rebelled against that, which is great. We’ve gone totally the other way, where I don’t want any structure.
Christine: You’ve got to have a little.
Brandon: I want all my stuff to come easily. That’s the other side of it. The truth is in the middle, as it often is. Let’s talk about Saturn for a second—actually, quite longer than a second.
Justin: Mine is in Virgo.
Brandon: Yours is in Virgo? Mine is in Sagittarius as well. Christine’s is in Capricorn. Mine’s in my third house.
Justin: I don’t know what house mine is in.
Christine: I know my Saturn return is in Capricorn.
Brandon: Your Saturn return is where your Saturn is. Your Saturn is in the fourth house.
Christine: What house was mine in? Sorry.
Brandon: The fourth house. That’s what I just said.
Christine: I thought you were talking to Justin.
Brandon: No. [laughs]
Christine: What does that one mean?
Brandon: Fourth house has to do with home, family, childhood—so kind of a more strict—you know where that comes from. Justin’s is—you said Virgo?
Justin: Saturn’s in Virgo, yes.
Brandon: Yes, you’re right. In your ninth house. Mine’s in Sagittarius in my third house, like I said. Saturn is that more strict part of the energy. It’s strict. It’s constricting and confining. It’s authoritarian. We don’t like that. That’s not so pleasant, right? Saturn is really the opposite of Jupiter in a lot of ways. They are similar in some ways and opposite in most ways. Saturn is always referred to as a very negative planet, but it doesn’t have to be.
Christine: It can teach, right?
Brandon: It can teach.
Justin: It’s a great teacher.
Brandon: Very good teacher, yes, but a very strict one. Saturn in Greek mythology was Kronos. Jupiter’s father, basically—Zeus’ father. The myth of Kronos is that he was afraid one of his children would overthrow him, so he ate all his children—the first five of them, anyway. Then Zeus came along and Zeus overthrew him. [laughs] So his worst fear came to pass.
Christine: That’s funny.
Brandon: Saturn is very real-world, realistic, that kind of thing. I’ve always been very against Saturn. It’s only in very recent times that I’ve gotten to appreciate what Saturn’s all about. Like I said, in law of attraction, we really go after the Jupiter energy. Let me explain a little bit about Saturn energy. Saturn energy is often called “the lord of karma,” because it’s thought that the suffering we get from Saturn is our karma from a past life. I don’t know about that, necessarily. It has to do with definitely where we need to grow and where we need to evolve.
Where Jupiter is expansive, Saturn is very constrictive and restrictive. You can still get abundance with Saturn. It just takes time. It’s the hard path working day in and day out, day after day, until you make that break and you get it. Saturn is about patience and all that stuff we really don’t want to hear about. [laughs] That’s what Saturn is all about. That’s the traditional path. You go to college, you get a degree, you get a good career, all that kind of stuff. You worry about real-world concerns. I am slightly cringing as I say that.
Justin: [sarcastically] So the path you took.
Brandon: Not the path I took. Not at all. [laughs]
Christine: Saturn is probably cringing…
Brandon: I have a lot of Jupiter and Uranus in my energy.
Justin: Saturn cringes whenever you come near it. [laughs]
Brandon: Yes, a little bit. [laughs] But I’ve come to appreciate Saturn. Like I said, Jupiter is all about quick luck, overnight success, that kind of thing. That happens, but it’s not always realistic.
Christine: The Saturn has to balance it.
Brandon: Saturn has to balance it. For example, like I said: people who have trouble finishing projects. You start a project. The Jupiter energy is really awesome. It’s going to get you going and inspire you. Then—how are we going to market it? How are we going to get customers? How are we going to sell this thing? How am I going to make money to survive?
Justin: Always been my problem.
Brandon: It’s those pesky real-world problems that we’d rather not look at, but we have to. A business that doesn’t look at how to market or sell our product or get customers is not going to be a long-lasting business. You have to look at these sorts of concerns. You have to look at the work that’s involved. When I say “work,” I’m not saying that it has to be work that you hate. It might not always be your greatest joy. I always hated marketing. It’s still not my favorite, but it has to be done. It has to be done. It’s just a necessary part of it. Any business owner out there, you know you wear all the hats. You have to be the marketer. You have to be the writer. You have to be the financial person. You have to do it all. There’s just not room for anything else, unless you can start hiring out—but that’s when the money has already started coming in. [laughs] You have to bootstrap.
Justin: A partnership—you’ve got to find somebody to help you out…
Brandon: Venture capital.
Justin: A person that covers your weaknesses. That would be a part of your spiritual chart helping you out, though. You still always run into it one way or the other. You can surmount it in more than one different way, but you eventually have to run up against it.
Brandon: That is what we have to look at. Bootstrapping. Bootstrapping is a really good word for it. You have to pull yourself up by the bootstraps.
Justin: I always had a funny imagination when someone says that. You’re trying to grab your own straps of your boots and pull you up. How do you do that?
Brandon: You don’t. The point of the expression is that it’s impossible or very, very difficult.
Justin: I’ve always had that funny…[laughs]
Brandon: I know. That’s Saturn for you. It’s stuff you don’t want to look at but you have to.
Balancing Jupiter and Saturn
Brandon: Where I come in, people often don’t like what I say that differs. Everyone says the law of attraction is about feeling good and no resistance and that kind of stuff—very Jupiter kind of feelings. I said the central driver behind the law of attraction is what? Tension. That’s very Saturnian, I guess would be the adjective.
Christine: [laughs] Saturnian.
Brandon: That’s what it is. I say that you have to work towards your goals. People say, “Just feel good about it. Just drop it. Don’t think about it, and it will come.” Not usually. Saturn is the part that says, “We’ve got to change these subconscious structures and make it happen.” When it comes to the law of attraction, you need both. I’m not saying all Saturn. All Saturn is very dull. Just Saturn is boring. It sucks the joy out of it. But when you have all Jupiter, it’s unrealistic. It’s ideal but not practical.
You want to balance the two in whatever you’re doing in life. Come to some kind of consensus and balance and agreement between those two energies. That’s really where Jupiter and Saturn come in. I know I’ve spent a lot of time on those two, but it’s so important. They’re totally different energies, but they’re so important, and we don’t want to look at them. We don’t want to hear that we have to put in the work. We don’t want to hear that we have to look at what’s holding us back. We don’t want to hear that it might take time or that we might not get it right away.
I worked on my dream for several years before it actually started to come to fruition. We don’t want to hear that. We want to hear about the overnight success and how everything just worked out overnight and the guy who won the lottery a few days after visualizing it or something. That stuff can happen, but it’s probably only after he did a lot of inner work first. That’s the balance that you have. Yes, you get those quick successes, but a lot more times than not, you have to work towards it. That is the balance we need to look at.
If you have an excess in one, it’s probably going to mean a deficiency in the other. You just want to work on balancing those, and you’ll be fine. An excess in Jupiter, and you’ll be too unfocused, flitting about here and there.
Justin: Great for luck, though. If you just need quick money or a couple of months of inspiration.
Brandon: Sure, but you’ve got to ground that. You’ve got to make it realistic. Too much Saturn, and you’re going to be denying your own dreams and afraid of doing what matters to you and passion and that kind of stuff.
Justin: Stagnant. Stagnation.
Brandon: You become stagnant. Passion is where Jupiter comes in, exactly. That’s where these two energies come in. I know I spent probably half the podcast talking about those.
Christine: They’re some of the most important, right?
Brandon: They’re by far the most important. The other three we’ll cover, and they’re also very important, but these two are really the ones you need to understand the most.
Christine: It makes sense. It’s like your whole life.
Brandon: Moving on to the transpersonal planets. First we have Uranus. This one was just discovered in the past couple of hundred years, so it’s a very new one. All of these have positive and negative aspects.
A lot of times, we eclectic spiritual types idealize Uranus. Uranus is the revolutionary and is about freedom, eccentricity. It’s the ruler of Aquarius, and we want to be in the Aquarian Age with technology and electricity. Electricity is ruled by Uranus also.
Brandon: Yes, electricity. It’s a Uranian attribution and rulership.
Christine: Okay. Okay.
Brandon: You sound surprised. [laughs]
Justin: Without Uranus, guys, there would be no lights.
Christine: I didn’t know that you could have aspects like…I thought they were just…
Brandon: Computers, too. Computers. Any kind of technology is very Uranian. That’s rulership, but it’s also revolutions in both their positive and negative aspects. Dictatorships, earthquakes, that kind of thing. That’s all Uranian. It’s upsets in the order of things, both positive and negative.
Brandon: It’s feeling alienated. It’s when you feel like you don’t belong. We’ve all had that. Where your Uranus is is where you don’t feel like you belong. It’s where you don’t feel like you fit in. You’re different. We all like to tell people. When I was reading the article about Uranus, they were joking about an astrologer or a client who said, “I knew astrology was true when an astrologer told me that I always knew I was different.” They said, “Everyone has a Uranus in their chart. They feel different somewhere.” We all feel different in some way. We all feel that feeling of not fitting in in some way.
Christine: Oh, yeah.
Justin: Yeah, okay. My Uranus is in Scorpio if I’m correct.
Brandon: Mine is in Sagittarius.
Christine: A lot of yours are in Sagittarius.
Brandon: Sagittarius is all about philosophy and spirituality and stuff, so I’m not surprised.
Christine: What about me? Justin asked, too.
Brandon: Yours, Christine, is in Capricorn in your fourth house. You have a lot in Capricorn. Justin’s is in Scorpio—is that what you said?—in your 11th house. Where your Uranus is is where you feel like you don’t always fit in. It’s where you feel different. It’s where you feel like you need to make changes.
Christine: So I don’t fit in at home?
Brandon: Fourth house is also childhood. It’s where you come from.
Christine: Makes sense.
Justin: Scorpio’s like weird because it’s all over the place.
Brandon: Scorpio is very dark and mysterious sort of thing.
Justin: I don’t know where that would be for me, then.
Brandon: 11th house is more about humanitarian efforts and helping others and where you are in society. Again, my third house—interestingly, about my chart—my Saturn and Uranus are basically right on top of one another. This describes a really interesting dichotomy in myself, and to a lesser extent but still enough, also conjunct with Neptune, which I’ll discuss in a few minutes. I have this really weird three-planet cluster going on in Sagittarius. I think Neptune’s in Sagittarius, too. I’ll check when we get to Neptune. There’s a really odd three-planet cluster going on in Sagittarius for me in my third house. It’s like all these very conflicting energies. You have Saturn with order and structure, and Uranus with breaking out of the order. [laughs]
That describes me really well because I’m very detailed in one sense and trying to structure my life, and on the other hand I like things to not be ordered all the time. I like to be unconventional. That’s a very good Uranian adjective: unconventional. My life has always been going back and forth between those two aspects. It’s all about balancing those. That’s Uranus. It’s good. It is very good, but it’s also difficult. Uranus is all about change. We like change after it’s done.
Brandon: I could say, “Oh, yeah, that was the beginning of that change. Thank God it’s done.” [laughs] The thing is, change involves instability. You can’t have change unless the old order breaks down. That’s not comfortable. We like our comfort zones. It’s not comfortable. Uranus really, really draws out where we feel comfortable and where we need change (not necessarily where we want to change, but where we need to change). Again, it’s very uncomfortable. It’s also where you feel like you’re different and alienated sometimes.
The other thing Uranus is all about is vision. When I talk about creating your vision of what you want, this is Uranus. This is what you want to create. The more unique it is, the better. Uranus is all about being unique and conventional. Create something that hasn’t existed yet. Ever since Uranus was discovered, we have tons of things that have been created that hadn’t existed before: computers, airplanes, televisions, all sorts of things. That’s what that’s all about. It’s holding the vision and creating a vision of what you want in life and going after it. That’s Uranus. It’s the visionary. It’s all about transformation. That’s really important. You want that vision. You want to create that vision, but again it has to fit in with Saturn, Jupiter, and all those. It’s all balanced.
An excess in Uranus would be if you (again, look at the dictatorship sort of thing) have revolution for the sake of revolution or overthrowing the old just so you can overthrow the old. It’s when you have no stability in life or something like that. You just don’t want to settle down into something. A lot of people are like that. I’ve been like that in my life. [laughs] I’ve been like that in my life for sure. That’s what it is. A lot of people, for example, have asked me before, “Why don’t you just stick with a certain religion and just stay there?”
Justin: I was going to go there.
Brandon: I say, “Why? Why should I?” I have my Jupiter in the ninth house. I’m all about expansion and seeking and going after things. I have a third house which is a lower octave of the ninth house—it’s just how you think and communicate, and I have Uranus there. I’m obviously a very unique thinker. Why would I want to stay in one place? Some people think that’s a bad thing. I don’t. I know it could get to a bad thing. Some people do it just because they get bored and need something different.
Christine: “Church-shopping” is what they call it in Christianity.
Brandon: Difference for the sake of difference.
Justin: That was me. I was a church-hopper for several years.
Christine: Church-hopping, not church-shopping.
Justin: I was a church-hopper for several years.
Brandon: A deficiency in Uranus is going to be where you are afraid to go after your vision. You’re afraid to be different. You’re afraid to embrace your uniqueness. You don’t want that, either. As always, these energies have to be balanced.
Uranus is a higher octave of Mercury. Why? They’re both to do with your thinking. Mercury is your intellect. Uranus is like the genius, the pretty insane genius or mad scientist. [laughs] It takes that thinking to the next level. It’s creating the vision and that kind of stuff. It’s a higher octave version of Mercury, if you can see that. That’s what that’s all about.
Brandon: Neptune. I love Neptune, but it’s also uncomfortable. Neptune in Greek mythology was Poseidon the sea god.
Christine: That’s right.
Brandon: I have always liked it. I have always felt pretty connected to Poseidon. Neptune is mysticism and dreams and all the stuff I love. The subconscious. Being connected with your higher self. All those great things we want to encourage. Guess what else Neptune is? Anyone have a guess?
Justin: Drugs. All kinds of dark energy, if you’re not careful.
Brandon: Yes. Addiction.
Justin: Addiction, intoxicants.
Justin: Poison, stuff like that.
Brandon: Exactly. Delusions, insanity. That’s Neptune.
Justin: Mine is in Sagittarius and in the first house, you said. What does the first house mean?
Brandon: Mine is (I believe also) in Sagittarius. Everything for Christine is in Capricorn. [laughs]
Christine: In the fourth house.
Brandon: In the fourth house. [laughs]
Justin: What’s up with that, Christine?
Christine: What does that mean?
Brandon: Mine’s in Capricorn. I’m sorry. Mine’s in Capricorn, also in the fourth house.
Christine: Wait, did you just check yours or mine? Or both?
Brandon: I checked yours and then mine. Mine’s in Capricorn in the fourth house. Yours is in Capricorn in the fourth house.
Christine: We both have the same thing.
Christine: What does that mean, then?
Brandon: Again, fourth house is about childhood and the home. It doesn’t have to be childhood. It could also be home now, your family. Neptune being dreams and subconscious and stuff like that. It’s just basically, I think, that the fourth house is what makes you feel at home, also. Spirituality. It could also be, if you’re not careful, your propensity to delusion. The propensity to fantasy. Neptune’s all about fantasy, so you have to be careful with that energy.
Justin: What’s that first house?
Brandon: First house is basically you. It’s your personality. Yours is Sagittarius, first house. It’s you as a person, what you are, what drives you, your personality. Neptune is a very dynamic energy. It’s a lot of change, so I’d imagine life would be very dynamic and changing a lot.
Justin: It’s actually strange because what it does (and I didn’t realize that until we started studying the houses, and I’ve always tried to figure this out) is make you look like stuff you aren’t.
Brandon: Yes, delusion.
Justin: It makes you look like stuff that you’re not.
Brandon: People misunderstand you.
Justin: Yes. Some people can pick up certain things. They can see certain things like “He’s in good shape. He’s had training.” Other stuff, it’s like you appear to be somebody who’s in business but you’re really not. You can do a lot of the in stuff, but I haven’t done a lot of the marketing. They say, “You should be in business.” Actually, I’m missing parts of that skill set. [laughs]
Christine: If people…
Justin: I don’t know. I always wondered that. It’s strange. People don’t react the same. Then you end up doing stuff or saying stuff that’s just outlandish. I don’t even know how to explain it.
Brandon: No, I get it. It’s all first house stuff. It’s Neptune. I get that.
Justin: You just do weird stuff. People are like, “What are you doing?” [laughs]
Christine: People think things about me, too. They think I should be a leader. I’m not a leader. I’m just not a leader. Everyone thinks so, but I’m not.
Justin: I can do it. I’m more of a lead….It’s really strange, because what it does is it’s dynamic like Brandon said. I’m the first man in. That’s really what you are. You’re the target. You’re the first man in. It’s pretty interesting. People say, “You’re a great leader.” Actually, I just sort of stick my head out there and stick my chest out there. You just see it coming first, sometimes.
Brandon: Christine’s probably wondering why….I was looking up her 10th house. Your 10th house is Cancer ruled by the Moon.
Christine: Wait, what?
Brandon: Didn’t you hear me looking up…?
Christine: Was it mine? I don’t…
Brandon: Yes, it was yours. Your 10th house is Cancer ruled by the Moon. Your Moon is in the 11th house of helping others. What I was looking up was planets in the 10th house. She was saying she was not a leader, and it’s true. The ruler of the 10th house is the Moon, and the 11th house is about humanitarian endeavors and helping other people. Christine loves that. It’s very emotionally fulfilling to her, so I was looking up that.
Brandon: Neptune, again, was discovered only a couple hundred years ago. Right after it was discovered, we have all this stuff with the occult, ghosts, spiritualism, that kind of thing. Not really an accident. That’s all about Neptune. A lot of people don’t even realize it and are trapped in Neptune’s negative aspects because we have social media and entertainment as an escape. Neptune’s about escape. Neptune’s very good with escapism and that kind of thing where you don’t want to look at yourself. Neptune will absolutely help you with that in a bad way. It’s not really authentic.
When you really drop the ego and go into Neptune and really connect, that’s when you have the more positive sides like your higher self, awakening, and enlightenment. Again, just like Uranus, Neptune really changes. It’s about breakthroughs. I was reading an article before about breakthroughs. The part of breakthroughs is the break. [laughs] Something has to break.
Christine: That is true.
Brandon: That’s Neptune for you. You have to be careful. An excess in Neptune. That’s always been me, pretty much.
Justin: It helps your creativity when it’s in the first house. Sudden stopping and starting, creative. It actually helps that in a strange way.
Brandon: Definitely. It’s very creative. An excess in Neptune or a negative side of Neptune: you’re going to be very escapist going into entertainment, or on the very negative side, alcoholism, addiction, drugs, that kind of stuff, propensity for delusion. Where do we have the highest risk for delusion? In spirituality.
Brandon: You hear about people in spirituality who think all sorts of things about themselves. They’re the Messiah or this or that, kind of nuts. Not to judge. How can you judge? Some authentic people appear insane just from what they say, but they’re not really. Some are. That’s what Neptune is. It’s all about appearances, and you just don’t know. You have to be careful with an excess because that’s what you’ll run into: that delusion. Be careful with that.
A deficiency in Neptune is: you’re just not connected enough. You’re too in-the-world. You’re not connected with your higher self and are not allowing yourself to receive those higher energies. It’s beneficial for you to be there, but you want to balance it and make sure it’s in the right way. That’s what Neptune is all about.
Now, Neptune is a higher octave of Venus because Venus is all about beauty and passion and attraction, like I said last time. Neptune is about dreams, mysticism, and kind of the same thing. It’s about creativity. That’s how Neptune takes the Venus energy to the next level.
Brandon: And Pluto. Christine hears my notes. [laughs] I’ll look up ours in a second. Pluto is about transformation. Pluto is my guy because he’s Hades, the god of the underworld. Pluto is the Roman version of the god of the underworld. He kidnapped Persephone and that kind of stuff. Kind of dark. But transformation—very much about transformation.
Christine: Dark does not mean evil.
Brandon: Dark does not mean evil. It’s just uncomfortable. I read the greatest quote. I don’t have the exact quote from this article I read. Basically, it’s that the suffering involved in Pluto with the transformation is not because of Pluto. It’s because of our resistance to what Pluto is trying to do in our lives.
Christine: Oh, I like that.
Brandon: Just like with anything, the universe doesn’t want us to suffer, but it’s going to happen if you’re resistant.
Christine: And we block the good things.
Brandon: Exactly. Hades, Pluto—both of you know, ever since I started working with Hades, it’s turned me around 180 degrees absolutely. He has really helped in a lot of different ways in my life. It has not always been pleasant. He’s more apt to say, “Do it yourself, and I’ll help you know how to do it, but just do it,” than to lend a helping hand and do it for me. He’s not really going to do that. Pluto is challenging, absolutely. That’s the thing about Pluto. Yes, you’re probably going to suffer, but it’s because of your resistance. It’s not because of anything else. Pluto will ask you to let go of something you need to let go of, an attachment of some sort. Not just random, but something that’s really holding you back. That’s another scary aspect. It’s something that’s disempowering to you. I know my Pluto—probably all of ours, at least I know Christine’s and mine are in Scorpio—is in the second house for me. Second house for Christine. Do you know yours, Justin?
Justin: Libra. Don’t know the house.
Brandon: 17° Libra. That’s a different generation, even. 10th house for you. Oh, Justin!
Christine: Tell him what it means, after you hear that.
Brandon: Again, Pluto is transformation. For me and Christine, second house—money—this has been so true, hasn’t it?
Christine: Is that what the second house is?
Brandon: Yes. It takes transformation. It takes a lot of change to get there. There’s the potential for it, but not before you transform and you really change how you see things. And that’s how it’s been for us. 10th house—I mean, that’s career. You’re going to see a lot of changes in your career, transformation in regards to your career that aren’t always pleasant. Obviously it always depends on the aspects and that kind of stuff. This is just basic. That’s what the 10th house is: career. So that’s what that is.
Again, Pluto is about transformation. It’s about what you need to let go of, how you need to change, how you need to grow, what the next step of your evolution is. That’s Pluto. It’s not easy. It’s not going to be easy, but it’s essential.
Christine: That is true.
Brandon: Pluto is a higher octave of Mars. Mars is that very willful energy. Pluto is also pretty willful and transformative. That’s how Pluto is. Like I said, I’ve worked with him for several months now. It’s definitely been that way. [laughs] That’s just sort of how it is. You need that Pluto energy, as much as we don’t want it. We don’t want to think about transformation. It’s death. Pluto is death and underworld. We don’t want to think about that stuff. You’ve got to face those things in order to come out the other side stronger. Pluto will always make you stronger on the other side.
Brandon: That’s what that is. An excess in Pluto energy—I don’t know how much that would really happen, because Pluto is pretty unpleasant to begin with. If you were to have an excess of Pluto energy, you’d be focusing too much on transformation and not allowing yourself to move on to the next stage. Transformation has to be followed up by the next step, what comes next when you become stronger and when you move on to what you’re supposed to do in life. That would be an excess.
A deficiency would probably be if you’re not allowing yourself to transform, if you’re holding on too much to what you’re attached to that’s holding you back. You’re not allowing that energy to come through and transform you. With Pluto, I think it’s such a wild energy that it’s really hard to really control it at all. It’s sort of hard to have an excess or a deficiency in it. If you’re holding on and you’re not allowing yourself to transform, then that could definitely happen. Or, if for some reason you’re focusing on it too much, you’re not allowing yourself to move on. That’s what would happen.
All of the Planets Play a Role
Brandon: To bring all this stuff together, one thing I’m going to say is I’ve talked about the gods a lot. I’m pagan, so I work with the gods. But this, to me, is how the gods are so active in our lives. I don’t really give god names for the Sun and Moon. You could say “Sol” and “Luna” in Roman. All of the other planets are Roman, so “Sol” and “Luna.” They all play roles. They all play a part in our lives. Sol, Luna, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, Pluto. They all play a role. They all play a part.
I’ve said this before. The gods are not all-benevolent. They’re not all-powerful. They’re not going to fix everything for us. What they will do is challenge us. They will help us when they can. That’s what you see in astrology. These astrological energies—to me, they’re how the gods are working in our lives. Where is Pluto helping you or challenging you? Where is Venus or Mercury or Mars or any of the others? Where are they in your life? In what way are they helping you or working with you? That’s what we have. It’s the energy of the gods generalized into these astrological planetary archetypes. These energies are with us all the time. It’s up to us to balance all these forces. The reason I wanted to do this series is I see imbalance among the spiritual community and the law of attraction community.
Brandon: I see a propensity to over-focus on Venus especially, Jupiter, Uranus, all these really nice planets on the surface. We want the beauty and the passion, the expansion and the freedom, the unconventionality and revolution, and all that kind of thing. We don’t want the restriction. Oh, and Neptune, of course, with mysticism and dreams and the subconscious. That’s cool. We don’t want the constriction. We don’t want the transformation with pain and suffering. We don’t want the willful Martian energy. We don’t want to look at that. Don’t tell me about that.
My whole point was they play a part in this, too. They are all essential. Mars energy, like I said last time, is how you get your big, next-level goals. That’s what Mars energy is all about. It’s that will to continue. Saturn energy, like I mentioned in Robert Fritz’s conception of the creation process, germination which is more like Jupiter with inspiration or even Uranus, and then the assimilation process. Not much is changing. You don’t see, necessarily, the results, but you’re getting closer and closer. That’s Saturn finishing the job, putting in the work, asking those difficult questions. That’s Saturn. You need these different aspects. Pluto to help you transform and let go where you weren’t able to before, where you’re hanging on to something that’s not serving you. These things aren’t comfortable, but they’re essential. Spirituality is not always a walk in the park. It’s not usually a walk in the park. [laughs]
Christine: It shouldn’t be, right?
Brandon: Yes, you want to live your highest joy and all that, but the path to getting there isn’t always easy. It takes transformation. It takes evolution. It takes change. That was really the point I was getting at with this series of podcasts covering all the planets. We have to look at all the energies, how they fit together, how they work together, how to balance them, and why they are all necessary in our lives. Like I said, I was never a fan of Saturn. Never. Still to this day, I don’t like tradition and that kind of stuff, but I’ve come to see how we really need that energy for our goals (like I said) to really put forth the work to get to the next level.
That is sorely needed in the law of attraction community: this conversation about Saturn and the work that’s necessary. Putting in the work. We don’t like to talk about that. It’s not part of it because it doesn’t feel good, but it’s part of it. Like it or not, it’s part of it. We have to have that conversation. We have to look at those things and be realistic about all this and how to live the best lives we can. That’s everything. That’s all the planets—all the major planets. Some people use minor ones. I was considering covering the lunar nodes, but it’s just not really relevant to this conversation.
Christine: Do that another time.
Brandon: Another time. Or maybe in an astrology class or something. I just want to have this conversation about the different energies at play and how they work together. I hope that it really was enlightening and really helps people to see where you might be imbalanced in life, why things might not be working out the way you want them to, where you might need to change things a little bit. That’s all up to you.
You can always ask these energies or the gods or whatever form they take for you that’s most comfortable. Ask them to help you out in your life. If you don’t have enough of one energy, you might say, “Hey, I need a little more. Can you help me out a little bit?” That will happen. It’s a relationship. It’s a path and a journey that you take. I hope that this helps. If you’d like to continue the discussion about this or just read the transcript, you can go to darkascent.org/unseen004.
If you want to rate, review, or subscribe to us on iTunes, you can go to darkascent.org/unseenitunes and that will redirect you there. I really enjoyed this discussion. I hope you guys did. [laughs]
Christine: It was so much fun.
Justin: It was good.
Christine: Makes me want a reading, though.
Brandon: I know. We’ll get there. At least you know some of your planets, anyway. I had the charts ready to go today. [laughs]
Christine: I’m so happy you told me. It’s fascinating.
Brandon: With all of that, I hope that everyone has a wonderful weekend. I am Brandon Olivares.
Christine: And I’m Christine Olivares.
Justin: And I’m Justin Williams.
Brandon: And anything is possible.
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